Do you think that the area of war in occident is over?

Robert

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It mind sound crazy but I often ask myself this question. We have many reason to think that we are safe (european union, nuclear bombs preventing from attacks, non-aggression pacts, etc..) but the human kind is still the human kind and history proved that we never learn from our mistake.

I don't see any potential threat right now but it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.
 

syringe

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Aside from Iraq, war is a brutal constant in the third world.

There will *ALWAYS* be a war going on in some far off corner of the world even if you dont hear about it on the news.

Africa/Southeast Asia/Latin America.

Civil Wars, Tribal Warfare, Military Coups.
 

Magnaflux

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I once read some historical research that concluded with the fact that humankind in all it's years has only had 300 years of peace.

If we assume civilization has been around 4000 years, that's only 7.5% of our time at peace. The remainding 92.5% of our time has been with wars going on.
 

Tacitus

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Magnaflux said:
I once read some historical research that concluded with the fact that humankind in all it's years has only had 300 years of peace.

If we assume civilization has been around 4000 years, that's only 7.5% of our time at peace. The remainding 92.5% of our time has been with wars going on.


Is this in the least bit surprising? It wasn't to me.
 

Mike Shagohod

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Magnaflux said:
I once read some historical research that concluded with the fact that humankind in all it's years has only had 300 years of peace.

If we assume civilization has been around 4000 years, that's only 7.5% of our time at peace. The remainding 92.5% of our time has been with wars going on.

Yep, all the more reason I hate the term "Civilized" and how haughty and high and mighty people, especially within an industrialized society seem to think themselves above their own inherent barbarism. Mankind is a violent bastard, and it's always been about being the poor bastard getting dominated, or dominating someone else. Hence the term To understand man, one must Know the history of war. Only the most deluded and self absorbed fuck twats, drunk off the vanity of their own minds and overly educated selves, would think man was anything but what it's always been. Funny how the most educated lack common sense 9 times out of 10, and think they can solve everything. Mankind's pulse might be getting softer thanks to international "Patty Cake" sessions, but beneath the surface man is still a violent animal, and war is in his heart. One usually just needs to find what it is that lights the spark on the powder keg.

...but then the Bible tells us (yes I know, don't bring it up right?) that all of man's deeds are Evil, hence why people must/should accept and place their souls in Jesus Christs hands. People are forgiven and saved from their inherent sin condition and eternal damnation, but sadly we are not CURED of the clusterfuck until the next life, which is odd that we've got ppl out in the world willing to strap bombs on themselves to kill non combatants in order to rush their way to the afterlife to do something there they could do here, at least when pertaining to virgins and all out fornication. What's sad is even now I know that just below the surface, and with enough tension the rabid dog in me is still very much there, and though I personally choose to live life like a Bear (7 parts in solitude 3 amongst ppl), guys like me are still but dogs, seeking our own kind in the wild, and are even more so inclined towards the fire within us, needing more than a lifeless ordinary, though bound by honor and a spiritual faith that keeps us tethered unlike the fools out there killing in cold blood... but sadly who's only absolution in this life is to war against those who would maim and war against those who were not born as aggressive. :(

...and the world just keeps spinning round.

GK
 
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BoriquaSNK

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I have to believe in the inherent goodness of mankind. There's no reason to believe in politics if you don't. It's a bit daunting, thats for sure.
 

galfordo

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Between the Middle East, South Africa, and Palestine, there'll will always be some nutcase starting/maintaining some type of conflict.
 

melchia

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Magnaflux said:
I once read some historical research that concluded with the fact that humankind in all it's years has only had 300 years of peace.

If we assume civilization has been around 4000 years, that's only 7.5% of our time at peace. The remainding 92.5% of our time has been with wars going on.

Actually since we have evidence of "civilization" dating back eleven thousand years and I'd question the source for "300 years of peace," I'd wager that the percentage of peaceful years is much lower than that.

less than 2.7%
 

Magnaflux

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melchia said:
Actually since we have evidence of "civilization" dating back eleven thousand years and I'd question the source for "300 years of peace," I'd wager that the percentage of peaceful years is much lower than that.

less than 2.7%


:spock:
 

aria

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Depends if you count South and Central America as occidental. If so, then no.
 

FeelGood

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im suprised to hear we've had 300 years of no fighting throughout our existance. nobody anywhere fighting eachother? i find that very hard to believe.

my guess is 0% peacetime if we consider the world as a whole. there has prolly always been some tribe fighting another tribe, even if not large scale.
 

norton9478

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WAR IS PEACE

FREEDOM IS SLAVERY

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
 

Mike Shagohod

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norton9478 said:
WAR IS PEACE

FREEDOM IS SLAVERY

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

the sad part is when one actually read into the reasoning behind such a train of thought within the book of Emanuel Goldstein within the novel of 1984, it makes more sense than it sounds ridiculous. Just like some ppl still don't get the saying... "I love war, I just hate the killing." Believe it or not there is meaning behind even that statement. If one were to put to the side the mentioning of the "Atomic Wars" of the 1950's, the breakdown of that novel within a novel is telling of more or less where we are at now, only it's not done in the manner that Orwell wrote about, it's much more subtle and high tech.

But let's look at that for a moment. WAR IS PEACE.

Well Winston (in the book) learns that since WAR is absolute chaos and the driving point for human neccessity to survive, keeping a perpetual war going on "somewhere" serves several functions. #1> Would be population control, something we do indeed do in the real world. #2> Is the concept of "Impetus Fire", where one will do what one must to survive. Thus true innovation isn't possible unless their lives are at stake. In our world of 2005, it's not nationalistic to the point of absolute iron boot control, but it could get there someday with the manner in which ppl will so easily hand over freedoms so that someone or some organization above them will protect them. In Winston's world of 1984, there is indeed innovation but it only serves those in the upper party of INGSOC, and rather than inventions being used for everyday use, it goes right back into the war machine to keep the nations at war, thus keeping a sense of equilibrium amongst the masses.

Ppl are generally greatful to have shoes to wear, and food to eat. I'm not for that version of it, but without the circumstance that WAR is, mankind is fat and complacent, as it stands we've stagnated as a Terra based sentient race. Thus if there is always war somewhere, then peace exists in the zones where it does not exist, but with the knowledge we are at war. Today it's not pre-fabricated wars we fight against enemies on a selected battlefield, but rather skirmishes for captialist power, and of course population control. If the sons and daughters of the working class and poor die, it leaves heirs for the rich to continue to stay there.

FREEDOM IS SLAVERY...

Well that's the ideaology but it's actually the other way around in reality. If a man is free then one can go where they want to, say what they want to and do what they want to. But when nothing of any real value is being done to further the evolution of social structure and human potential, then the very freedom to do such things are nothing more than leg irons and the prison bars we have before us are unseen. Thus it's not important to rule with an iron boot over a people when the people can keep themselves in bondage. A poor person once strived to be out of that circumstance (and some do still), but when most can abuse the welfare system as a generational tradition, there's no incentive to progress forward. Let the people who actually bust ass for a living get 4 months of their yearly pay taken out to pay for them. Let BIG BROTHER continue to do for you, until one day it does indeed turn into the severity of what Orwell's dystopian alterverse, only much worse with the technology we have. I find it odd how ppl can't see that often times prosperity is just as much a hindrance as it is good. One must ask themselves what is prosperous? Simply doing the same thing everyday because in reality we're allowed to be free but it's not true freedom. For if one really did think outside the box, did go where they wanted and more they'd be labeled something fancy by some schmuck with a PHD and forgotten about. Or if not that severe, just never taken seriously. So everyone tows the line, slavery of the mind and of human potential, all done in by the very FREEDOM they think they have, but in reality the freedom does nothing to proliferate change towards something more than a status quo.

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH...

More or less self explanitory. Today we've got a collective majority who is either NIMBY minded (not in my backyard)... or only educate themselves to a point that one has been processed achieve a particular station and title in life. Beyond that, most are intelligent within the field of endeavors, but have no real understanding of the world around them. There's no proper motivation to go beyond the distance of what already is, and help usher in an era of new frontiers. Shit by now we should have had a lunar colony and well be on our way to MARS. But we're the type of sentient beings who love to recieve praises from one another, value things that aren't worth shit in most cases, and once we'd been to the moon (assuming it really wasn't the best lie ever told), we figured it wasn't neccessary. We delude oursleves into believing we need to know up-to-the-second coverage in a warzone where lives are lost because of some fuck head reporter who causes more instability than cohesion, but mankind won't realize we've done just about everything there is that's going to be done on Earth. Thus those who see through all the candy coated bullshit, who do educate continually outside of operational curriculums are the enemy of the collective who really on some inner level wish to stay ignorant. Thus Strength would be within that, for the masses eat whatever is put before them, and seek for others to do for them rather than themselves.

GK
 

norton9478

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Magnaflux said:
NO BLOOD FOR OIL


TEAR IT ALL DOWN

Really?

I thought that the meaning of said quote was rather appropriate for discussion in this thread.... Especialy even your quote
Magnaflux said:
Actually since we have evidence of "civilization" dating back eleven thousand years and I'd question the source for "300 years of peace," I'd wager that the percentage of peaceful years is much lower than that.

less than 2.7%
 

Magnaflux

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I never said we've had civilization for 11,000 years. :spock:

Who pulled an edit on that one?
 

norton9478

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Magnaflux said:
I never said we've had civilization for 11,000 years. :spock:

Who pulled an edit on that one?

Not me, I just coppied and pasted.
 

Lagduf

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BoriquaSNK said:
I have to believe in the inherent goodness of mankind.

I'm with you man, I do believe in an inherent goodness within all man.
 
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