Need Help Repairing Neo Conversion Cab

[chimera]

Hey guys, Im looking to get a MVS cabinet and found the only one in my area on craigslist within very reasonable distance. I talked to the guy and he said everything works fine and it is a two slot system with two games (samurai showdown and metal slug 3) that are interchangeable lol. I plan on going to check it out on very soon.

My big concern is does it look like it is a real Neo Geo Arcade Cabinet or does it look like a conversion cab? Any tips to finding out when I go check it out?

Can fellow members provide any tips on what i should be looking out for and what to avoid when looking to purchase a Neo cab? thanks.

Also the guy is asking 325 for it.



This was the only picture provided of the cab.

 

[ggallegos1]

if it's a reasonable distance, try going there and taking more pics of the sides and inside. if you're gonna drop 325 on a cab, you might as well see exactly what you're getting.

 

[chimera]

if it's a reasonable distance, try going there and taking more pics of the sides and inside. if you're gonna drop 325 on a cab, you might as well see exactly what you're getting.

Well I guess the distance kinda reasonable, not very reasonable. I should have thought that out more. It would be 100 miles there and back and I gotta bother a family member to use his truck since i drive a 07 malibu and a cab will obviously not fit lol. Im going to visit family in the area so the traveling wont be a waste of gas.

Thanks for the reply ggallegos1. Im hoping to only bother the guy once when i go test it out and see if i can make a deal. So getting pictures and uploading all the way back at my place would be a lot of traveling.. But if the cab seems that questionable ill deferentially pass on the deal and snag pictures to post on here.

A Cab in my area seems to good to be true lol. I've been waiting for years for one to pop up.

 

[Tyranix95]

It's a conversion.

The cab is a Dynamo cab--SH-3, with a corner cut panel, I think.

Was a popular cab for SF2: CE/HF.

Looks like the panel was re-cut for NEO.

 

[chimera]

It's a conversion.

The cab is a Dynamo cab--SH-3, with a corner cut panel, I think.

Was a popular cab for SF2: CE/HF.

Looks like the panel was re-cut for NEO.

The corners on the panel is what set my first alarm off that it was a conversion cab.
Thanks for the input Tyranix95. Now im not to sure about it lol.

 

[kuze]

What Tyranix said, definitely a conversion. I probably wouldn't pay $325 for it, but that's just me.

 

[Dion]

Neo Conversion = $150 tops unless there is a super rare game included. Which there is not. My opinion.

 

[chimera]

Neo Conversion = $150 tops unless there is a super rare game included. Which there is not. My opinion.

Thanks for the advice Mitsurugi-w, the games it comes with are very common. Im gunna be in the sellers town tomorrow so i guess there will be no harm in checking it out. No way ill pay the asking price since its a conversion. Hopefully he'll budge off his asking price. Its a bummer because its rare for anything neo related to pop up locally in the lower part of texas so this may be my only option for any type of neo cab / neo conversion..

 

[Neorebel]

There's nothing wrong with a conversion cab. Make sure you can deal with the button layout, and that the monitor is nice and bright & everything works well. I got mine for 200 something and it came with a really nice copy of Mag Lord. I was on a budget and the other issue was that a big red would not fit through any door in this house. Sometimes when you find something you just have to go for it.

 

[chimera]

I ended up buying the neo conversion cab. I got it for 250 with six games. The seller had threw in windjammers, kof 2000, kof 2001, and ultimate 11, along with the metal slug 3 and samurai showdown he had listed (also the seller gave me a free unlabeled bootleg i haven't cared to try out). I mainly bought it because i really wanted windjammers and Im glad I saved those carts because he had them in a bag buried in his storage unit. Overall the cab does need some tlc cosmetically but is a total blast to play a game of metal slug on an arcade with my wife lol. The screen seems great but a bit crooked on the top of the monitor. Im gunna see if i can carefully mess with the pots behind the monitor tomorrow.

Noob question but does anyone know where i can purchase cherry switches to replace the ones on the buttons. Or is it better to just purchase the buttons totally new? A few of the switches under the buttons seem a bit worn and I am thinking about just replacing all of them.

I was on a budget and the other issue was that a big red would not fit through any door in this house. Sometimes when you find something you just have to go for it.

Lol I did not anticipate the door measurements before I bought it. But when I got the cab to my door, I prayed lol. It would have sucked for it not to fit. I am usually good about preparing things before hand but I guess I was just excited to see some neo games locally.

 

[Tyranix95]

Haha!!

---

Check Paradise Arcade Shop.

Check out IL Sticks and Buttons, and Cherry Micro-switches.

 

[xsq]

Check Paradise Arcade Shop.

Yup. I'd just go for all new buttons and sticks, they don't cost the world and there's more than the micro switches to wear out on a stick. You could also consider putting Sanwa JLFs or Seimitsu LS-32 in your cab if you prefer those, might be more work to get them mounted though.

Post some pics of the screen, maybe the good folks here can help you fix that.

 

[chimera]

Yup. I'd just go for all new buttons and sticks, they don't cost the world and there's more than the micro switches to wear out on a stick. You could also consider putting Sanwa JLFs or Seimitsu LS-32 in your cab if you prefer those, might be more work to get them mounted though.

Post some pics of the screen, maybe the good folks here can help you fix that.

Wow, thanks for the suggestions about the joysticks xsq. I'm new to all this cabinet restoration stuff so any recommendations like that are greatly appreciated. It looks like I would prefer one of those joysticks you recommended opposed to the ones on there now.

Ill be uploading some pictures of the video problem I am having with the monitor later tonight.

Also if anyone knows how to troubleshoot audio problems since there seems to be a problem with the audio on the cab. At first I thought it was the speakers that were being used, however, I swapped the speakers out and the sound was still problematic. It sounds really low with a lot of static when i turn the volume up on the board (MV-2F). I have to have the volume below the half on the mv-2f board for it to sound okay and even then it sounds super low and lacking in audio detail. I also tested the headphone jacks and they sound spectacular compared to the audio ouput coming from the harness connected to the mv-2f. Could this audio problem be the board or the wiring harness maybe? any suggestions to this would be great.

 

[chimera]

Here are pictures of the CRT problems I'm having.

First here is a rough picture I drew up in paint really quick on what I see to be the problem happening with the CRT on the cab. The image is straying to the right, the picture appears a bit crooked in the upper part of the monitor, and there is a light shadow effect that seems to be happening mainly on darker screens.


Here is how the monitor looks on the left since it isn't centered. You can see a blank screen next to the image. However this doesn't happen on all games but clearly shows that the screen isn't aligned correctly.


This shows an early cut off on the right side (second players side of the monitor)


The test screen on the mvs showing the curving effect on the upper part of the screen



This shows the screen vearing to far to the right thus cutting off some of the second players side of the screen.


On the second players side you can see that the blue safe zone isn't viewable.


Here is how it gets problematic, when playing puzzle games it really sucks as you can tell it is crooked on the top and to far to the right on the second player.



and finally a picture of the shadow effect happening on dark screens in the wonky line area (the shadow effect is the dark part on the upper part of the screen, easily seen on metal slug).

Picture of the mvs board casing. Apparently Gordon was on Eddies ass lmao.


I found some pots to adjust the image on the arcade monitor board. The only pots I can find are the H-Pos, H-Hold, V-Pos, V-Size, V-Hold, BLK Level/Bright, Cont/Contrast, Focus, and Screen. There are also Pots for RGB but I wouldn't think adjusting those would help any. Adjusting the H-Hold Pot seems to make the wonky line (illustrated in orange on the drawing) and the gray/shadow effect area go away but makes the top of the screen lean considerably left or right depending on how its adjusted.

If anyone has a recommendation or thoughts on what I should try to troubleshoot on the monitor or on the audio problem mentioned on the above post I would greatly appreciate it if you would post.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsZ5PJB-w2s This CRT repairing bad ass gives me hope lol.

 

[Tyranix95]

Open the back of your cab. Take a pic. of the back of the monitor board. Post the pic.

---

But basically,,,

In order to shrink or expand the screen width, you need to get into the back of the cab, find the monitor chassis, and find a coil called the Horizontal Width Coil.

You adjust it by putting a plastic screw driver (TV Repairman's tuner) inside it and turning the head (screw bit) to one side (or the other). And checking the screen. And seeing if you're heading in the correct direction. If not turn the other way. Keep turning until you like screen size.

In general, a long way goes a little bit.

Never Ever let the screw head fall out of the shaft!! It 'll be a PITA to put back in.

And NEVER EVER EVER break the coil!! Be gentle with it.

 

[Tyranix95]

Get inside your cab. Take a picture of the back of your speakers. Post the pic.

---

But In General,,,

IIRC, Dynamo cabs are JAMMA standard cabs and are wired for Mono Sound.

MVS boards have MVS edge connectors, which are almost identical to a jamma edge connector. One of the BIG Differences is in the Sound Configuration.

MVS uses STEREO out put at the edge connector. So if you connect it to a Mono Sound Jamma cab, you will only hear half of the audio channel, and your game will sound terrible.

 

[chimera]

Open the back of your cab. Take a pic. of the back of the monitor board. Post the pic.

---

But basically,,,

In order to shrink or expand the screen width, you need to get into the back of the cab, find the monitor chassis, and find a coil called the Horizontal Width Coil.

You adjust it by putting a plastic screw driver (TV Repairman's tuner) inside it and turning the head (screw bit) to one side (or the other). And checking the screen. And seeing if you're heading in the correct direction. If not turn the other way. Keep turning until you like screen size.

In general, a long way goes a little bit.

Never Ever let the screw head fall out of the shaft!! It 'll be a PITA to put back in.

And NEVER EVER EVER break the coil!! Be gentle with it.

I tried taking pictures but the lighting sucks so it wouldn't be too helpful. But I did some searching and found the model number for the CRT board. It is 25k7193. Doing some searching on the model number I found a diagram that shows the screen adjustments.


Looking on the board I found the horz size adjustment but it hardly looks like it does on the diagram. I did some searching and the horiz size adjustment really looks like this on the board. this picture is of the horz size on the same model board as mine.


Im pretty sure this is what I need to adjust? It doesn't look like a pot where i can just turn it. How exactly does adjusting this "thing" work?

Is this what you were talking about adjusting with the plastic screwdriver Tyranix95? and also by "do not let the screw head fall out of the shaft" do you mean the black part in the shaft? MAN, This horz size adjustment is in a really really tight spot lol. kinda scary..

Edit: found out all the info i need to know about the horizontal width coil. Going to mess with adjusting it once I get the right tools.

 

[chimera]

Get inside your cab. Take a picture of the back of your speakers. Post the pic.

---

But In General,,,

IIRC, Dynamo cabs are JAMMA standard cabs and are wired for Mono Sound.

MVS boards have MVS edge connectors, which are almost identical to a jamma edge connector. One of the BIG Differences is in the Sound Configuration.

MVS uses STEREO out put at the edge connector. So if you connect it to a Mono Sound Jamma cab, you will only hear half of the audio channel, and your game will sound terrible.

Some pictures of the speakers in the cab.


It does look like the speakers are wired up for mono as they are wired in parallel to each other. And boy you are right they sound terrible. I almost just want to only use headphones because its so bad. Also I did the audio test on the MVS board and both Left and Right Audio Outputs put sound to both speakers but the Center Output does not put sound to anything. Does this confirm it is a jamma connector with mono audio? How can this be fixed.

And thanks a ton Tyranix95. I truly appreciate all yours and every bodies input in helping trouble shoot the cab.

 

[Billkwando]

It does look like the speakers are wired up for mono as they are wired in parallel to each other. And boy you are right they sound terrible. I almost just want to only use headphones because its so bad. Also I did the audio test on the MVS board and both Left and Right Audio Outputs put sound to both speakers but the Center Output does not put sound to anything. Does this confirm it is a jamma connector with mono audio? How can this be fixed.

And thanks a ton Tyranix95. I truly appreciate all yours and every bodies input in helping trouble shoot the cab.

I don't know much about rewiring the jamma harness, but I know you can take the audio right off the board from the headphone connector. My 1 slot board had a connector for headphone and speaker, but since it seems yours has 2 headphone connectors, that works just as well (assumeing I'm looking at the right manual, page 9):

http://www.hardmvs.com/manuals/MVS-2-25.pdf

If you look here, you can see where I used one of those old PC connectors you'd use to connect a CD rom drive to your soundcard, but any 4 pin flat PC connector should do (you can rip one out of an old case if you have one laying around):



Since you're not planning on swapping in other jamma boards, there's no reason not to run the speakers directly from the board.

Edit: If your cab came with 2 speakers mounted, you're lucky as hell. Mine came with one and even though it has speaker slots precut, I had to make screw holes to mount it, which was a huge pain in the ass. It took a gooseneck drill thingy and a really stubby screwdriver. Also make sure you have grates in there if there's gonna be any kind of little kids anywhere near it who might want to stick their fingers through your speakers.

 

[Tyranix95]

...

....

Yeah, that's the Horizontal Width Coil.

Turn that one way and you'll make the screen wider. Turn it the other way and you'll make the screen shorter.

In a jam, I've been able to hold a Torx Bit with my fingers, and turn the coil head. It's not recommended. But it works.

 

[Tyranix95]

...

...

This is what you need to do next. Find a pen/paper, small pair of needle nose pliers and a Multi-Meter.

Pick a speaker. Write down which color wire (quick disconnect tab) is hooked up to which spade (speaker connector).

Then disconnect the speaker wires from the speaker. Set your m-m to to 200 Ohms Test. Put one Probe Tip on each speaker spades (hook ups). The m-m will give you an ohms reading. It should either be either around 4 Ohms or around 8 Ohms. Write down the reading. Then reconnect the speaker wire. And do the same thing with the other speaker.

Finally, go to the harness. Disconnect it form the board. Find pins 10 & L on the edge connector. And put a probe tip on each pin. The m-m will give you an Ohms reading. Write that down too. Then reconnect the harness.

If the speakers are set up in Parallel, then a speaker's Ohms will drop by 1/2 when connected to the speaker circuit.

(S1 Ohms * S2 Ohms) / (S1 Ohms + S2 Ohms) = Total Ohms in Circuit.

(8 Ohms * 8 Ohms) / (8 Ohms + 8 Ohms) = 4 Total Ohms.

 

[Billkwando]

Isn't that just dual mono? Why?

Edit: I guess it would be useful info, but I'd stab myself in the eye before I played in mono. Of course, I'm the weirdo that insisted on having an original Dynamo speaker when I added the 2nd one for stereo sound (which didn't take long).

Edit 2: If you're thinking about painting it, check out this thread:
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...-paint-codes&p=3226698&highlight=#post3226698

 

[Tyranix95]

2, 4, and 6 Slot boards are can handle either STEREO (MVS) or MONO (JAMMA) sound--if the board is set up correctly--just like your 1 Slot NEO JAMMA board.

Granted STEREO sounds way better that MONO. But the reason why his board sounds like crap right now is because the speakers are not setup correct.

The board sends Right Audio over Pin 10 and Left Audio over Pin L. And, the one pair of speakers is all confused because it's hooked up to BOTH sound channels (both pins 10 & L) at the same time. So it's trying to do two things at once, which it can't.

 

[chimera]

I spent all morning trouble shooting and adjusting the pots on the stupid screen and finally found my problem. A ground wasn't connected on the neck board... I guess the previous owner messed up some where.

this was the results I had when I was messing with the pots in the morning. (very ugly lol)


the ground i found that wasnt connected.



The bottom of the neck board showing the ground that wasnt connected messing up the upper part of my screens geometry. (some one did a have ass solder job next to the ground..)


I resoldered the ground and the lug then grounded it to a screw.


And doing so instantly fixed my image! yay!

 

[chimera]

I don't know much about rewiring the jamma harness, but I know you can take the audio right off the board from the headphone connector.

Hey Billkwando, I would prefer to pull the audio off the connector than use the headphone connector. I just want i to be right lol. great suggestions though.

Yeah, that's the Horizontal Width Coil.

Turn that one way and you'll make the screen wider. Turn it the other way and you'll make the screen shorter.

In a jam, I've been able to hold a Torx Bit with my fingers, and turn the coil head. It's not recommended. But it works.

I had a bunch of torx screws and was able to find on that fit in there perfect. I also wrapped black tape around one end so it wouldnt burn my fingers since the metal would heat up when adjusting with the monitor on. This is what I needed to fix the screen width.

This is what you need to do next. Find a pen/paper, small pair of needle nose pliers and a Multi-Meter.

Pick a speaker. Write down which color wire (quick disconnect tab) is hooked up to which spade (speaker connector).

Then disconnect the speaker wires from the speaker. Set your m-m to to 200 Ohms Test. Put one Probe Tip on each speaker spades (hook ups). The m-m will give you an ohms reading. It should either be either around 4 Ohms or around 8 Ohms. Write down the reading. Then reconnect the speaker wire. And do the same thing with the other speaker.

Finally, go to the harness. Disconnect it form the board. Find pins 10 & L on the edge connector. And put a probe tip on each pin. The m-m will give you an Ohms reading. Write that down too. Then reconnect the harness.

If the speakers are set up in Parallel, then a speaker's Ohms will drop by 1/2 when connected to the speaker circuit.

(S1 Ohms * S2 Ohms) / (S1 Ohms + S2 Ohms) = Total Ohms in Circuit.

(8 Ohms * 8 Ohms) / (8 Ohms + 8 Ohms) = 4 Total Ohms.

Wow great information, Ill defentily give this a try and post back thanks Tyranix95!!!

Isn't that just dual mono? Why?

Edit: I guess it would be useful info, but I'd stab myself in the eye before I played in mono. Of course, I'm the weirdo that insisted on having an original Dynamo speaker when I added the 2nd one for stereo sound (which didn't take long).

Edit 2: If you're thinking about painting it, check out this thread:
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...-paint-codes&p=3226698&highlight=#post3226698

Yes the mono audio makes me want to stab myself in the eye lol. Thanks for that link I do plan on restoring the cab but first want to work out any hardware issues before I jump in too deep. Thanks for that link, ill definitely look into it.

2, 4, and 6 Slot boards are can handle either STEREO (MVS) or MONO (JAMMA) sound--if the board is set up correctly--just like your 1 Slot NEO JAMMA board.

Granted STEREO sounds way better that MONO. But the reason why his board sounds like crap right now is because the speakers are not setup correct.

The board sends Right Audio over Pin 10 and Left Audio over Pin L. And, the one pair of speakers is all confused because it's hooked up to BOTH sound channels (both pins 10 & L) at the same time. So it's trying to do two things at once, which it can't.

Yes, I think that is whats happening to the audio. Im going to look over the wiring a bit later and ill post back what i see and some pictures as well.

Thanks everyone for the great info, i really appreciate it. Keep it coming