Why haven't any of you doll fuckers started a Game of Thrones topic?

[100proof]

I actually enjoyed the first two episodes of this season. Sure they were pandering and probably won't hold up on rewatch but after being gone for two years, it was nice to see characters reunite and have several characters' arcs more or less tied up neatly.

But yeah, I'm with everyone here... the last two episodes have been a disaster. Completely shitting the bed for payoffs on long-term storytelling. Dispatching the series' biggest threat set up since the first episode halfway through the season in about the most unceremonious way possible. Wasting time pandering to stupid fan theories and, even worse, fan romances. Completely undermining multiple characters' long-term growth with terrible decision making. It's just asinine from top to bottom.

I haven't bothered reading the spoilers because, with only two episodes left, I'm fine with riding this out but I have zero confidence that they're going to turn it around. These clowns clearly weren't up to the task of finishing this (pretty much everything from Season 6 on has been middling to bad) and it looks like people will have to wait for GRRM for a satisfying conclusion to that story. Good luck with that... dude is 70 and has put out one SOIAF book in the last 15 years.

 

[Lastblade]

Until it's confirmed they're not being published, any speculation to the contrary is wind. Martin has even said the next book is coming out.

Now, if you want to say he's slacking in his responsibilities, I'm all on board with that. Fucker has been sidetracked with Sad Puppies and football and convention appearances and that's on him.

But I refuse to believe a consummate writer like Martin, who has invested so much of himself into this series, would simply walk away from it and not make a formal announcement.

So you might be right. Maybe the books will never come out. And I say this with all due respect but 'you know nothing, Lastblade.'

I was being cheeky, but I honestly don't think he has the energy, will power, or time (because he fucks around so much with other projects and generally basking in his glory) to finish these books. Maybe 20% chance of the next book coming out, and 0% chance of the final book.

 

[Taiso]

I was being cheeky, but I honestly don't think he has the energy, will power, or time (because he fucks around so much with other projects and generally basking in his glory) to finish these books. Maybe 20% chance of the next book coming out, and 0% chance of the final book.

Yeah, I get you and that's why I ended my statement with respect and a ASoIF joke.

He's stated that he's had difficulty writing it because he feels the pressure of delivering a satisfactory ending and sometimes, he can't even write a sentence. That's a lot to deal with and as a writer myself, I definitely respect that and that's why I'm not fed up with him, or Kentaro Miura on Berserk, for that matter. I have sympathy.

But, you know, at some point you have to wonder if maybe the guy shouldn't just go somewhere cold that doesn't have internet but which has a staff of people to attend to his needs so that he can just shut out the world and finish the thing.

 

[Taiso]

Skin in the game is interesting in that I would not use that to describe Arya Stark and the battle against the Night King. That wasn’t her fight. He wasn’t on her list. He wasn’t a reason that her family members died. And we don’t know if the Night King ever wanted to hurt a single stark, or if he just wanted to tell Bran to stop stalking him.

When the Night King laughed off Drogon's fire, I was suddenly wondering if it was because he was just 'powerful' in a fantasy bad guy sense or if he was actually of Valyrian descent (somehow) and not a Stark (as many theories have speculated) before he got changed.

I thought about the possibility of that wrinkle and immediately stopped pursuing it. There isn't enough time left in the series to explore that but man, what an interesting twist that would have been.

I watched one YouTube channel's thoughts about Jon being denied a showdown with NK. It's called GreyArea (or maybe GrayArea), and she's really on point with her understanding and analysis of the material (although I don't always agree with her conclusions).

She rationalized S08E03's ending as 'fine' largely because she doesn't want to be bitter about a series she loves so much, although she admits that she still doesn't like the Deus Ex Arya.

She said that NK played it smart with Jon in that he knew Jon could easily destroy him in a fight. That's why he ambushed him in the snowstorm, almost reversing Jon's intent to 'draw out the Night's King' and take him down quickly. After taking his best shot and surviving, NK decided that he couldn't take Jon right at this very moment and decided to instead delay him and put distance between them so that he could get about the business of killing Bran, since he felt he was more vulnerable.

All of which is fine...if that idea had been seeded properly. Instead, the audience is left piecing together a reasonable explanation for all of this and that simply isn't good storytelling. Even when you don't make it plain as day and you ask the audience to be a bit intuitive, if it all feels broken and stupid...you've fucked it up.

Still don't know why he didn't have Vyserion just torch the Godswood with Bran in it but hey, gotta make sure the Burlington Bar normies get their social media reaction.

 

[greedostick]

Yep, I binged True Detective Season 3 for the two months that I have HBO Now.

Which was another completely disappointing ending.

 

[norton9478]

Really, if you had to pick a person to destroy the night king, Arya has to be near the top of the list.

 

[evil wasabi]

Really, if you had to pick a person to destroy the night king, Arya has to be near the top of the list.

What?

Dude please. Read the books and get back to us.

 

[Taiso]

Really, if you had to pick a person to destroy the night king, Arya has to be near the top of the list.

Make sure to tell us where you are in the next Burlington Bar reaction video.

 

[norton9478]

What?

Dude please. Read the books and get back to us.

I have seen every episode of the TV series, and that is what we are talking about.

The Book is the Book, the TV series is the TV series.

 

[HDRchampion]

Are you cunts still complaining...Man there are only two episodes left enjoy it. Going to wear this tonight, i think Celganebowl is happening!

 

[evil wasabi]

Are you cunts still complaining...Man there are only two episodes left enjoy it. Going to wear this tonight, i think Celganebowl is happening!

View attachment 54011

How much did your wife spend on that useless toy?

 

[HornheaDD]

So that list of spoilers someone posted, so far its 100% accurate lol.

Damn this show is going to have such a terrible ending.

It's so pathetic.

 

[Lets Gekiga In]

Which was another completely disappointing ending.

The ending was a bit unexpected, but I enjoyed the journey. I probably just enjoy seeing Mahershala Ali's work.

 

[Taiso]

The Burlington Bar reactions are going to be lit AF, y'all.

 

[Neorebel]

I enjoyed the action aspect of the episode, but storywise it seemed cheap... but expected. It could only go in a direction like this, the same way it has been going for a while now. The only unexpected thing was the way they handled Cersei

 

[Taiso]

Spoiler:

I feel like this season wasted Lena Heady, who has been one of the brightest spots in this entire series.

Arya's decisions in this episode don't make any sense to me yet. The coming week is going to have a lot of discussion about this episode and its thematic intentions for Arya Stark. I feel as though they were trying to do...something with her here but for the life of me I can't seem to figure out what. I feel like they were going for something cerebral and intuitive while at the same trying their hand at subversion. It just felt like the writing had her on a forced march towards a specific end and absent decompression, I'm not sure that 'live' is a very potent message at this point. There are missing beats that are sorely needed to close the loop to achieve a meaningful intent with her riding out of the wreckage of King's Landing on a white horse.

Clegannebowl was stupid, pointless and a waste of time. It meant nothing and was pure fanservice. Terrible.

Same goes for the fight between Jaimie and Euron. They're fighting over Cersei but the problem is that Jaimie should, as a character, be beyond Cersei. The story is basically saying that no matter how far down a noble path of atonement Jaimie goes as a person, he can never escape Cersei's orbit. What was the point of it all, then? Just because they were born together, they should die together? If that's the case, why not just keep him as a bad guy and save us all the time?

I actually liked the juxtaposition of Cersei and Danaerys both falling apart in this episode. The idea of it is spectacular. They are both so desperate to will themselves to victory simply because they want it. There's a beautifully tragic aspect to that that really speaks to me as a fan.

Less so for the way in which Euron's men forgot how to fire those lethal Scorpions. Why weren't they ready and waiting to fire them? They knew that the attack was coming. This isn't a case of bad tactics and strategy. It's a case of bad writing. On the other hand, a dragon in attack mode might be harder to hit than one in scouting mode but still, the number of ships in Blackwater Bay, as well as all the Scorpions on the battlements, stretches credulity a bit too far. They were essentially useless when it counted, but it would have been more effective and believable relative to the portrayal of the city's defenses if there were far less of them.

The Golden Company was wasted. All that time building them up simply to have them wiped out by an OP dragon as a spectacle is an insult to storytelling. They didn't have to make a great accounting of themselves, but this just feels like they were, in the end, an inconvenience to D&D, who had bigger plans for them early but ditched them because they just want this to be over.

Varys' execution felt too tame. In Season 05, you showed people spitting directly in Cersei's face. But when Varys gets burned alive, we don't even see a burning body? The lack of graphic visuals, at this point, feels out of place in this series. We once watched a pregnant woman take knife stabs to the belly, and we watched Catelynn Stark's throat get slit before our very eyes. Varys' smoldering body would have been more effective.

Dany's descent into madness is the development upon which the series' conclusion hinges, since they chose not to make it the Long Night as they should have. After ending an existential threat to the entire world, this squabbling over the Iron Throne just feels so petty and bizarre to me. I still don't know why anyone is supposed to care about the Iron Throne. It's like nobody learned anything from their experiences against the Night's King, and uniting against a common foe that defied human understanding was the POINT of that entire struggle. Bottom line: Dany going Mad Queen is not meaningful because we, as an audience, see it happening all too quickly and it's hard to buy. The groundwork for this has been there the whole time. They seeded this twist very well. But they harvested the fruit well before it was ripe for the picking.

I will say that I hope the spoilers about Jon killing Dany are true. I feel that, on paper, this beat feels right to me. When Jon realized Maester Aemon was once Aemon Targaryen, an heir to the Iron Throne, in both the book and the TV series I knew it was a sign of Jon's fate. He would see service in the north as vastly preferable to the politics of King's Landing. Jon is beyond politics, but his standing by and watching all this happen makes him guilty by association. It's only fitting he seek redemption serving the realms of men rather than having them serve him.

An extra four episodes and a reordering of some of the season's beats would have made this vastly more satisfying. I will continue to dream of a spring when Martin's books finally come out to have a satisfactory ending, however.

 

[evil wasabi]

Almost everything in the episode was mapped out by the guy bulbousbeard linked to on reddit. The episode was still enjoyable, mainly for the production value.

Spoiler:

First off, did Daenerys just 3D print out more Dothraki? I thought she lost almost every one of them in the battle of Winterfell.

Arya was just a prop in the episode to increase the emotional effect of Daenerys's indiscriminate massacre of Westerosi. I think they could have done this with Jon too. It didn't matter to me much. Overall, the scenes of destruction in the city were gratifying. Her story is almost over now that Sandor gave her an intervention on revenge.

Cleganebowl, on the other hand, was useless. I don't think the fans who really cared about the book really give a shit about that scene. The showrunners thought it was beautiful, so whatever.

I liked the fight between Euron and Jaime in that it showcases Euron's psychopathic character really well. Probably his best scene in the tv show. He leaves the show with the best line in the episode. I'm also glad that they didn't try to Tetris this with Yara fighting Euron. Yara can stay on the iron islands for all I care. Dispensable character.

Unfortunately, we know exactly how the final episode will unfold.

Spoiler:

Major characters will beg Daenerys to show mercy to the innocent civilians. Tyrion will tell Jon that he and the Starks will never be safe from Dany because of his lineage. Jon will pledge his heart to Dany before killing her. Then Jon will go back to the wall as penitence for his crimes. The surprise is gone.

So that list of spoilers someone posted, so far its 100% accurate lol.

Damn this show is going to have such a terrible ending.

It's so pathetic.

except the part about Brienne trying to talk to Jaime, after being captured, and he refuses. But yeah...

Also, Valonqar prophecy was a mistranslation.

Spoiler:

"Little brother" could also be "little bricks." So ironic that Cersei so afraid of her smallest brother, but surrounded herself with bricks instead.

 

[smokehouse]

Real talk...are we hiding spoilers again? We haven't been for a while so I want to make sure before I start typing stuff.

So...for now...

Spoiler:

I agree that Jamie's character should have been evolved to the state where he is through with Cersie...but I guess he's not. So, the fight and taunting between he and Euron was fun to watch and Euron's taunting him even as he laid there dying was fun.

Cersie's death was a complete joke and an overall embarrassment to the entire series. For such a complex character and the series main antagonist, her end was just pathetic. Why the writers decided to turn her death into this fake tear jerker with her and Jamie embracing each other is WAY beyond me. Nothing about any of that felt right, it was a completely limp ending for such a horrible character.

I'm with Wasabi concerning Arya...I wasn't 100% sure why this was all needed besides the single 10 second conversation between her and the Hound. Her staggering around in the flames didn't seem necessary to me and I do feel Jon would have been much better. His decent into coming to the conclusion that Daenerys must not survive would have been aided by that.

I'm with Taiso concerning the "dragons are cannon fodder" vs "dragons are an atomic bomb" flip-flop. Two were killed like chumps and before last night, have only been mildly useful thus far. Yesterday's display of destruction was fat-man and Little boy level, why she just didn't take out the entire iron fleet the second they killed her 2nd is just dumb. Either they're easy to kill, or not.

I enjoyed Daenerys turning into a super cunt...and so did Cersei, who had a lovely scared smirk on her face when Daenerys turned the city into a hog roast. I've never liked Daenerys as a character, she's always been a spoiled brat and this was a lovely culmination of years of my disliking the character.

The final battle of the Glegane brothers did seem rather useless, although watching the mountain smash the brains out of the mad scientist hand of the queen was fun.

I also agree with Taiso that the death of Varys was limp.

 

[LoneSage]

They've given all the scenes that should have been Jon's to Arya this season。It does feel weird. Jon has not had a single memorable moment this whole season.

 

[evil wasabi]

Real talk...are we hiding spoilers again? We haven't been for a while so I want to make sure before I start typing stuff.

So...for now...

Spoiler:

I agree that Jamie's character should have been evolved to the state where he is through with Cersie...but I guess he's not. So, the fight and taunting between he and Euron was fun to watch and Euron's taunting him even as he laid there dying was fun.

Cersie's death was a complete joke and an overall embarrassment to the entire series. For such a complex character and the series main antagonist, her end was just pathetic. Why the writers decided to turn her death into this fake tear jerker with her and Jamie embracing each other is WAY beyond me. Nothing about any of that felt right, it was a completely limp ending for such a horrible character.

I'm with Wasabi concerning Arya...I wasn't 100% sure why this was all needed besides the single 10 second conversation between her and the Hound. Her staggering around in the flames didn't seem necessary to me and I do feel Jon would have been much better. His decent into coming to the conclusion that Daenerys must not survive would have been aided by that.

I'm with Taiso concerning the "dragons are cannon fodder" vs "dragons are an atomic bomb" flip-flop. Two were killed like chumps and before last night, have only been mildly useful thus far. Yesterday's display of destruction was fat-man and Little boy level, why she just didn't take out the entire iron fleet the second they killed her 2nd is just dumb. Either they're easy to kill, or not.

I enjoyed Daenerys turning into a super cunt...and so did Cersei, who had a lovely scared smirk on her face when Daenerys turned the city into a hog roast. I've never liked Daenerys as a character, she's always been a spoiled brat and this was a lovely culmination of years of my disliking the character.

The final battle of the Glegane brothers did seem rather useless, although watching the mountain smash the brains out of the mad scientist hand of the queen was fun.

I also agree with Taiso that the death of Varys was limp.

So the dragon issue isn't as you're describing it. Episode 5 has Tyrion approach Dany to inform her of a traitor in their mist. She says it's Jon (and gives a chilling explanation why), and Tyrion is like "no.... Varys". The idea is that Varys told Cersei that Dany would be taking her fleet to Dragonstone, and Cersei has Euron lie in wait. That's why they were able to take out Rheagal so easily. But sneak attacks don't work so well after the first time. So of course, Dany and Drogan were not going to be flying carelessly to Kings Landing after that. You have to also accept that most of the time nothing threatened the dragons, period. Their air superiority took for granted that anti-air existed in the form of magic ice javelins or ship mounted scorpion ballistas. So catching the dragons by surprise wasn't that surprising.

 

[wyo]

Why did they not show Daenerys' face at all while she's torching the city? They should have had her laughing gleefully like Max Zorin in A View to a Kill.

 

[NeoSneth]

spoiler tags at this point is silly.

I had the least amount of issues with this episode for the season. All that anger and fear was finally released. Boom it exploded.
Things could have been done better, but they could have also been much worse.

Who's gonna kill the Mad Queen?

 

[HDRchampion]

Yes fucking Cleganebowl delivered!

 

[HornheaDD]

Yes fucking Cleganebowl delivered!
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Actually that was pretty underwhelming. 2 minutes long. Lame.

 

[evil wasabi]

Actually that was pretty underwhelming. 2 minutes long. Lame.

yeah, but his wife bought him a replica helmet for The Hound.