Darksoft's Next Project

[kuze]

CPS1 and 2 hardware is almost identical. There are things CPS2 boards do that CPS1 boards do, things that CPS2 games never used.

When you understand the patches needed to allow CPS1 games to run again on CPS1 hardware once the battery is gone you then know most of the patches needed to make them run on CPS2 hardware also.

That is a simple task to anyone who has made decrypted CPS2 sets, it should be a breeze for the avalaunch guys. I personally don't have to time to do it presently or an order for the CPS2 flash device anyway.

Raz

If we were to pitch in and donate enough for you to get a cps2 multi, would you convert the qsound cps1 games to cps2 for the community? Cadillacs on CPS2 would be awesome

 

[Razoola]

If we were to pitch in and donate enough for you to get a cps2 multi, would you convert the qsound cps1 games to cps2 for the community? Cadillacs on CPS2 would be awesome

The problem I have would still be finding the time, having a device would certainly make it easier though.

 

[Syn]

If we were to pitch in and donate enough for you to get a cps2 multi, would you convert the qsound cps1 games to cps2 for the community? Cadillacs on CPS2 would be awesome

The problem I have would still be finding the time, having a device would certainly make it easier though.

If Raz hadn't mentioned having no free time to do it, that would have been a great idea kuze.

 

[Asure]

Hacking up Progear to a point where it shows the hitbox on the players' sprite ín-game' as other cave games do would also be nice

CPS1.5 -> CPS2: The Qsound games use the CPS-B21 'gfx ppu' unit at $800xxx, this is what raz is referring to as 'easy'.
But there are also some differences in i/o for example, and the way roms map. (On a dead battery _default_ CPS2 $800140 = B21, and $800100 = CPS-A, these things match up..)

Certainly, it should be very possible to have those games running, but there will be _a lot_ of patching. Having the multi kit as dev board will very much speed things up

 

[Fox1]

CPS1 and 2 hardware is almost identical. There are things CPS2 boards do that CPS1 boards do, things that CPS2 games never used.

When you understand the patches needed to allow CPS1 games to run again on CPS1 hardware once the battery is gone you then know most of the patches needed to make them run on CPS2 hardware also.

That is a simple task to anyone who has made decrypted CPS2 sets, it should be a breeze for the avalaunch guys. I personally don't have to time to do it presently or an order for the CPS2 flash device anyway.

Raz

Interesting, thanks for the explanation!

 

[Mike26]

I have been away from the community for a long time, a lot has changed in that time. At least it seems as such, I love hardware dev stuff, count me in for a neo board just for the hardware porn... I love this community and each and every one of the devs, software and hardware devs. I wish you all well and good times for the community at large.

 

[Mattroid]

Definitely down for a NG flash cart - there's a lot of interest in one, not only here.

Would it be practical to work with them to release purchasable versions of their games that would only work on your multi-cart?

I can't be the only person that wants to play Last Hope: Pink Bullets, RAZION, etc on the MVS in my cab for a reasonable amount of money (i.e. not $500+ for a limited run kit).

I'm with you there, though I definitely see the concerns. ArcadeSD does something similar with D2K. You have to have the DK rom on the SD card, you need to purchase a license from Jeff here, then run an update to validate your license, which allows access to the game. I assume there's an online database somewhere that gets checked when you run the update in order to validate the license.

 

[darksoft]

Good discussion, I feel the same way about author work that is still production being protected. The conversation of having option for protected files on the flash cart is really interesting. If devs could skip the hardware portion it opens up lots of possibilities for new development. If this took a lot of work, maybe darksoft could distribute the roms in a protected manor and take a small fee so that the dev and darksoft both have an incentive.

I'm touch with NGDEV, they don't seem interested in the option of taking a fee to make their cartridges work in a flash cart. It could be done with a AES encryption that is linked to a specific cartridge, so you don't have access to clean roms and if you take the files to another cartridge won't work.

 

[darksoft]

The problem I have would still be finding the time, having a device would certainly make it easier though.

Wait a second, are you trying to say that my device could be extremely helpful and awesome for people developing code?

 

[Razoola]

Wait a second, are you trying to say that my device could be extremely helpful and awesome for people developing code?

I was saying it would help in making it easier to test converting CPS1 games to work on CPS2 hardware.

 

[Adderall]

I'm touch with NGDEV, they don't seem interested in the option of taking a fee to make their cartridges work in a flash cart. It could be done with a AES encryption that is linked to a specific cartridge, so you don't have access to clean roms and if you take the files to another cartridge won't work.

Too bad for NGDEV then

 

[Razoola]

Wait a second, are you trying to say that my device could be extremely helpful and awesome for people developing code?

I just wanted to expand on this a little more. Your flash cart does make it easier for testing homebrew stuff on real CPS2 hardware but not much. Most homebrew stuff that would need testing would be in the program ROM space only given everything else can be done accurately in emulation. Flashing a 512k EPROM would take about the same time as getting the code onto the SD card and then uploading it to your device. What really narks homebrew devs is the delay it takes in testing builds, I personally used an EPROM emulator for example. So its like 50/50 if your talking a small code base given any dev would always keep a supply of blank EPROMs handy.

What A dev would really want weather it be CPS2, NeoGeo or any other hardware is all CPU related memory spaces to be entirely RAM so it can be interacted with extremely quickly and directly via a pc.

So I would say with NeoGeo, CPS2 or any other device if its built with homebrew and not playing games as its priority it would have only used flash for graphics and samples and also given a way for direct connection to a PC.

If your thinking about homebrew with NeoGeo I wold say the P and M data must be in RAM on the cart /maybe FIX tiles also given its only 128kb. RAM that preferably is also battery backed up and also directly connectable to a PC through USB. If you were to do that it would help homebrew devs much more than it being a flash cart only. then again if it could be entirely RAM for sprites and samples also that would be even better.

Even though NGD is not interested you should still build in some protection that homebrew devs can take advantage of if they so desire.

 

[werejag]

wouldnt preformed protections be a defeat in that protection? and is it really the cart makers per-view. should not the game dev roll his own?

 

[Razoola]

wouldnt preformed protections be a defeat in that protection? and is it really the cart makers per-view. should not the game dev roll his own?

Indeed any maker of customs PCBs can find a way to protect against a NeoGeo flash cart, detecting a flash cart in the case of Neo Geo at least is also easy if its designed to load work with all SNK games. This is more related to any dev maker who wanted to sell their work without having to build their own cart or by sacking original SNK games to build one. It gives them a viable option without the need of making a PCB because they could target a sale of work to one flash cart only (due to encryption on the data they sell that could only be decrypted on one target flash cart).

None of this is related to any dev work of the past or even present but more for dev work going forward.

Like darksoft said he could use an AES encryption for example. Again not for everything but only for those who wanted to use it. The flash cart would always be able to load standard stuff.

 

[werejag]

im talking about if darksoft added preformed protections that are well documented. that a game dev can reuse. wouldn't that be rather be weak protection and easily patched? thus defeating the whole protection gimic.

 

[Razoola]

im talking about if darksoft added preformed protections that are well documented. that a game dev can reuse. wouldn't that be rather be weak protection and easily patched? thus defeating the whole protection gimic.

I agree that would be weak if a well documented encryption was used. It should be something original.

 

[werejag]

then why the fixation on darksoft doing it instead of each dev game maker? seems not a task for darksoft to do.

 

[Mugicha]

Obviously there is a big interest in a Neo Multi here, and I agree that one is needed in comparison to the 161, 128 etc, however $300ish is more than I'm willing to pay for it. I'm not saying it's not worth that much for the time and effort needed to produce it, it just isn't to me. Everything Darksoft has done impresses me so I'm just happy to see him keep doing things like this.

While we are doing wishful thinking here, what I'd like is a Naomi multi-cart, I know I know

STFU Mugi there's alrdy netdimm etc.

but hear me out. What I would like is to be able to boot games like the GD-rom games without the transfer time, be it Net/GDrom/CF, For instance, instantly booting up CvS2 as if it was a cart like CvS. I'm not positive, but I figured that's how it would work with those Ikaruga Bootleg Carts that showed up on Ebay. Also hopefully the Atomiswave games could insta-boot with this as well, since I've had absolutely NO LUCK getting those to work

Anyway, not expecting this to happen, just wanted to state what I'd like to see.

 

[aoiddr]

While we are doing wishful thinking here, what I'd like is a Naomi multi-cart, I know I know but hear me out. What I would like is to be able to boot games like the GD-rom games without the transfer time, be it Net/GDrom/CF, For instance, instantly booting up CvS2 as if it was a cart like CvS. I'm not positive, but I figured that's how it would work with those Ikaruga Bootleg Carts that showed up on Ebay. Also hopefully the Atomiswave games could insta-boot with this as well, since I've had absolutely NO LUCK getting those to work

Joerg of ArcadeModBios managed to create 2-in-1 Naomi Carts, but a Naomi multi is something that is just really not needed at this point (especially if it meant passing over something like the Neo or F3), nor would it be any cheaper than buying a Net Dimm and PiForce.

 

[Mugicha]

Joerg of ArcadeModBios managed to create 2-in-1 Naomi Carts, but a Naomi multi is something that is just really not needed at this point (especially if it meant passing over something like the Neo or F3), nor would it be any cheaper than buying a Net Dimm and PiForce.

I completely agree, not needed given the options already available for naomi, nor would I hope it take the place of one of the other projects, just wishful thinking is all

 

[Razoola]

then why the fixation on darksoft doing it instead of each dev game maker? seems not a task for darksoft to do.

I suggest you read again my posts again and stop sticking on selective pieces, you make yourself look silly otherwise.

I already stated I'm surprised NGD did not already take their PCBs one step further to do this already.

I would bring up the same points I have in this thread with any flash cart maker on any system that has a strong professional homebrew scene (like the NeoGeo). These things have been discussed long long ago (as I also stated) but I guess you missed that also. Anyone making a flashcart on a system would listen to what the homebrew community has to say if they are serious about making a product aimed at them also and not just playing free games. That goes to anyone making flash carts.

What you have not done is actually comment on the suggestions I have made in relation to what would be good for such a flash cart to use in relation to NeoGeo.

Do you agree with any of the following and if not then please discuss.

- Dropping the LCD screen is a good idea?
- Having the game selection menu controlled on the neoGeo a good idea?
- Having a direct hookup to pc a good option?
- Replacing P ROM/MROM/SROM with battery backed up RAM a good idea?
- Including a encryption based protection for any dev wishing to use it a good idea?

As I have already said.... Because of the load times related to a Neo Geo flash device (well over a minute), anyone wanting such a device for SNK games only would be better off getting a multicart given that can do the same thing as a flashcart but instantly.

Current multicarts are implemented poorly, there is much they could do that don't.... Like remember and always boot to the previously selected game, a better menu system implementation that does not patch the game at all. Better coding so they don't turn off memory card support in error or other coding to lock out softDIPs.

Be aware of some of the potential issues in making a NeoGeo flash cart. Unless the flash cart maker spends the time to accurately handle all the protections on SNK carts you will also be limited to the same versions of games flashcarts use (which is another gripe these multicart users have). This is things like the custom banking on later SNK games, random number generators inside the cart, ram in the cart, FIX tile banking (2 different methods).

If its just about playing SNK games and nothing more (which is why most would buy this) please discuss why a flash cart is a better option than a multi cart.

If your going to use the homebrew angle then instead please discuss what is not good in the suggestions made that would actually aid said community.

There is no reason such a device cant do both is there?

 

[Chempop]

I’d like to see people learn how to play the games they already own

err I mean CV1000/SH3 multi would be swell

 

[werejag]

since im not allowed to discuss this ill depart this thread. good luck with the project razoola im sure your flashcart will be amazing.

 

[Razoola]

since im not allowed to discuss this ill depart this thread. good luck with the project razoola im sure your flashcart will be amazing.

Ahh come on, what sort or reply is that for active discussion, you have already commented in this thread. Why do that if you were not allowed?

 

[darksoft]

since im not allowed to discuss this ill depart this thread. good luck with the project razoola im sure your flashcart will be amazing.

LOL! No, it won't because he can't make one, but wait! he can tell you how you should do it.