Square Enix to File For Bankruptcy? Earnings Down 91%, Final Fantasy XIV to Blame

[Nesagwa]

Yeah, it's TOTALLY those new guys that draw everyone looking like a woman.

 

[SPINMASTER X]

Yeah, it's TOTALLY those new guys that draw everyone looking like a woman.

The Japanese have always drawn pretty boys but back then it was more of a novelty because not EVERY DAMN character looked that way. Nowadays EVERY male looks like a woman. It's worn its wear.

 

[Deuce]

You can't tell me you didn't flinch when you saw Cecil. They turned him into a drag queen! The character designers at SE now are terrible.

He looks like the original Amano art design. Like it or not, they haven't changed it. Personally, I'd have preferred a touchup of the DS version. They really got that one right.

 

[Zenimus]

Yeah, it's TOTALLY those new guys that draw everyone looking like a woman.

I never really liked Amano's art style to be honest. It's too abstract and "artsy" for my tastes.

Sure, Cecil looks womanly in the original Amano art too, but it's so stylized that it's still left up to your imagination as to what he really looks like. But the new designers seem to have taken it literally and made him as feminine as possible.

 

[Taiso]

I said this in another thread, but I'll reiterate it here.

The problem isn't that the protagonists of a story look effeminate:

Alucard and Vampire Hunter D, and even Cecil, may have an eastern flair to their look, but their concepts are universal. To Japanese audiences, they have many Japanese characteristics and this makes them easier for those audiences to embrace. Western audiences can also relate to those characters too, and that is why no one complains about them having long hair or overly fancy clothes or looking too derived from a particular subculture. They have a universality to them-they are both sensitive AND ass kickers. The earlier FFs were sprite based, so half of the characters'; identities were transplanted from the player. But when those personas become too distinct, they start to lose the universality. Unless they're characters with serious depth (like, say, Lost Odyssey,) that is more often than not going to fail the publishers.

S-E has many years of declining sales to learn from. It's time they did so and returned some universal themes to the franchise. While they still can.

 

[Zenimus]

In the case of that Alucard picture, I think the design looks great because it fits the character. He's a aristocratic vampire, so being a little thin and well groomed feels right.

With Cecil, he's a regular human, the ex-captain of some knights, and he's a very strong fighter. His gaunt frame and blatant facial makeup just doesn't fit the mold, if that makes any sense.

 

[Deuce]

His gaunt frame and blatant facial makeup just doesn't fit the mold, if that makes any sense.

So you'd be fine with the look of the character if it were more "abstract?" You're really just painting yourself into a corner, here. The look is true to the original design. Just admit that you don't like it because it doesn't match your impression of what the character should look like, and that'll settle it.

 

[Loopz]

BTW, everyone digging up the examples of Amano's art as an example of how these character designs have always been feminine are missing something critical: while the artwork itself may have had that look to it, the sprites in those games themselves never really looked like that. There was always a very minimalist charm to those games, especially with the small animations and expressions the sprites would show.

FF has lost a lot of key aspects that were once considered essential to what made a quality JRPG. The last game didn't even have explorable towns, for Chrissakes. With the enormous capacity of modern hardware, this is completely inexcusable. They need to stop dwelling on making every moment a graphically showstopping cutscene.

Through FFIX, the series held tightly to these conventions. FFX is when the ornate designs really took the fuck over and there was less and less exploration.

 

[Poonman]

Amanos watercolored doodling rocks my world.
His style is what Final Fantasy is all about...

Imagine if they remade ff6 where kefkas tower looked like this?

And chocobos looked like this?



His style has little to do with femininity. It's hard to describe....it has a wispy, otherworldly "quaintness" to it, very dreamlike.
The images look so frail but it leaves such a hard mark on the imagination, not even the hyper realistic 3d graphics of todays games can compare.

 

[Zenimus]

So you'd be fine with the look of the character if it were more "abstract?" You're really just painting yourself into a corner, here. The look is true to the original design. Just admit that you don't like it because it doesn't match your impression of what the character should look like, and that'll settle it.

I fully admit that it doesn't doesn't match my impression of what the character should look like. I'm not suggesting that my opinion is the universal rule of character design.

I guess I'm just tired of the "effete sensitive teenager" type being in the lead role.

 

[Nesagwa]

The reason's sprites don't look anything like the what Amano designed them to look like is because they couldn't.

Now that technology allows them to match the concept, they do.

Gonna have to come to terms with the fact that Final Fantasy has ALWAYS been full of feminine men.

 

[Poison Sama]

You can't tell me you didn't flinch when you saw Cecil. They turned him into a drag queen! The character designers at SE now are terrible.

Flinch? Oh, I didn't flinch. I tingled with delight. That version of Cecil is incredibly hot.

With Cecil, he's a regular human, the ex-captain of some knights, and he's a very strong fighter.

He's half-human.

 

[ForeverSublime]

Amanos watercolored doodling rocks my world.
His style is what Final Fantasy is all about...

Imagine if they remade ff6 where kefkas tower looked like this?

And chocobos looked like this?



His style has little to do with femininity. It's hard to describe....it has a wispy, otherworldly "quaintness" to it, very dreamlike.
The images look so frail but it leaves such a hard mark on the imagination, not even the hyper realistic 3d graphics of todays games can compare.

I can see that. . . reminds me of Italian or French Midieval paintings - but more deteriorated as if they were stored in England.

There's a long stretch between "feminine" imagery 600 years ago and today (but don't go digging up any bad examples ), and that's what I see.

Edit: @Nes: Of course your view and comment are completely valid. Posture makes a difference, though. (notice how all the pictures of Poison Sama posted all have the breasts covered so you can't tell what to look for).

 

[Poonman]

Is that a wimpy Cecil swooning in the arms of his big strong brother Golbez?

Dude....


I'm a huge perv and nothing shocks me these days, but this.....whew....this really is a wake-up call.

 

[LoneSage]

People need to start backing up their claims of girly men and give examples, post pictures, etc.

Vaan excluded.

 

[SouthtownKid]

So you'd be fine with the look of the character if it were more "abstract?" You're really just painting yourself into a corner, here. The look is true to the original design. Just admit that you don't like it because it doesn't match your impression of what the character should look like, and that'll settle it.

While you're busy bashing people for not being as big a fan of makeup-wearing metrosexuality in their main characters as you are, keep in mind that Amano also designed the chibi versions (or whatever you want to call them) that actually appeared in the game, as Loopz pointed out. And in those simplified in-game sprites, the characters were more of a blank slate (as Taiso mentions) that players could project themselves onto. And those in-game sprites are just as much -- if not more -- the "original designs" as the image/tone illustrations, some of which bore very little resemblance to characters, vehicles and objects actually in the game.

The more specific the characters in later games become, the smaller a segment of society they appeal to, until you reach the point we're at now. The mainstream appeal of Square's recent characters is extremely low now to the point that it's hurting the company.

 

[BigFred]

FF has lost a lot of key aspects that were once considered essential to what made a quality JRPG. The last game didn't even have explorable towns, for Chrissakes. With the enormous capacity of modern hardware, this is completely inexcusable. They need to stop dwelling on making every moment a graphically showstopping cutscene.

Through FFIX, the series held tightly to these conventions. FFX is when the ornate designs really took the fuck over and there was less and less exploration.

Whilst I do get your point, making exploration limited with fewer "towns" isn't necessarily a bad thing. At some point the game has to tell it's story, giving the odd sidequest here and there.

My main issue with the late FF's is the grinding is both boring and incredibly tedious. For anybody here who has tried to "complete" FFXIII you know what I'm talking about. Getting a character's ultimate weapon maxed should involve completing a hidden dungeon etc. Not fighting a certain enemy 500+ times.

The sidequests in the last few FF games feel like they are just designed as time-fillers. If you are persistent and willing to put in the extra 50+ hours then you'll succeed, it's not challenging just time-consuming. Their focus needs to change, but I may not be the type of gamer they are targetting.

 

[SonGohan]

While you're busy bashing people for not being as big a fan of makeup-wearing metrosexuality in their main characters as you are, keep in mind that Amano also designed the chibi versions (or whatever you want to call them) that actually appeared in the game, as Loopz pointed out. And in those simplified in-game sprites, the characters were more of a blank slate (as Taiso mentions) that players could project themselves onto. And those in-game sprites are just as much -- if not more -- the "original designs" as the image/tone illustrations, some of which bore very little resemblance to characters, vehicles and objects actually in the game.

The more specific the characters in later games become, the smaller a segment of society they appeal to, until you reach the point we're at now. The mainstream appeal of Square's recent characters is extremely low now to the point that it's hurting the company.

Get a job.

 

[HeartlessNinny]

While you're busy bashing people for not being as big a fan of makeup-wearing metrosexuality in their main characters as you are, keep in mind that Amano also designed the chibi versions (or whatever you want to call them) that actually appeared in the game, as Loopz pointed out. And in those simplified in-game sprites, the characters were more of a blank slate (as Taiso mentions) that players could project themselves onto. And those in-game sprites are just as much -- if not more -- the "original designs" as the image/tone illustrations, some of which bore very little resemblance to characters, vehicles and objects actually in the game.

The more specific the characters in later games become, the smaller a segment of society they appeal to, until you reach the point we're at now. The mainstream appeal of Square's recent characters is extremely low now to the point that it's hurting the company.

This is a lot of twaddle.

Deuce and Nes are right. FF has always been full of girly men. If you think otherwise, I suspect you're probably just under the influence of nostalgia.

 

[Loopz]

This is a lot of twaddle.

Deuce and Nes are right. FF has always been full of girly men. If you think otherwise, I suspect you're probably just under the influence of nostalgia.

I was just talking with Cecil, and he has no trouble logging into Steam.

 

[HeartlessNinny]

I was just talking with Cecil, and he has no trouble logging into Steam.

Okay. That was kind of funny.

P.S. Steam still sucks donkey dicks.

 

[SouthtownKid]

This is a lot of twaddle.

Deuce and Nes are right. FF has always been full of girly men. If you think otherwise, I suspect you're probably just under the influence of nostalgia.

Absolutely false. If you actually break those original NES and SNES games out -- not the various remakes with added cutscenes or re-done character art -- you'll see there was great disparity between Amano's tone illustrations and how the characters were presented within the actual games. I think the one with the faulty memory is you.

 

[HeartlessNinny]

Absolutely false. If you actually break those original NES and SNES games out -- not the various remakes with added cutscenes or re-done character art -- you'll see there was great disparity between Amano's tone illustrations and how the characters were presented within the actual games. I think the one with the faulty memory is you.

Are you... are you serious?

You clearly have no clue what you're talking about whatsoever. The pictures of Cecil that people have posted are from when FFIV first came out. That's the character design. I don't give a fuck what was actually depicted in the game, the design is the design is the design. And it's not like we never saw it, they were in the manuals, on the boxes, in magazines, etc etc.

The fucking end. That's just how it is. You're getting senile, old man.

Say what you will about the older games, whether they're better or whatever. But if you're gonna complain about the character design being 'girly' when it didn't use to be, you're wrong, plain and simple.

And there's so much else you could complain about. Too many zippers/pockets/pouches/whatever.... A lack of innovation... Less endearing stories... All of these could be applied to the last few FF games. But the character designs have been 'girly' since the very early days.

 

[LoneSage]

 

[Dr Shroom]

gay

nice thighs though, probably got some child-giving hips too.